Never Quit: 35 Years of Real Estate Finance Lessons With Robert Withers

Robert Withers (00:00)

That’s easy. Never quit. Never quit. Just never quit. You know, I— I know it’s a cliché. You— we’ve heard it. I mean, everybody from Denzel Washington, Oprah is all over social media saying don’t quit, right? But I’ll tell you right now, as a— not a Denzel or an Oprah— Oprah Winfrey, I’ll tell you never quit. Never ever, ever stop.

Quentin Edmonds (00:22)

Wow. Never—

Robert Withers (00:25)

I can’t tell you how many times through my thirty-five years in this industry and in life in total that I was faced with situations that looked insurmountable. Absolutely insurmountable.

Quentin Edmonds (02:11)

Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Real Estate Pros Podcast. I am your host, Q Edmonds, and I am excited to be here today. I am excited about my guests. We have a gentleman that has a ton of experience, so absolutely know what he’s talking about. He’s in the real estate finance business. we can, by his admission, we can— we can call him a broker. And broker is not a nasty word, right? So and I’m gonna let him explain more about his— his position when it comes to that. But this gentleman has been in the game for a while. He’s very proficient at what he does, and I cannot wait for us to get to the peek through his lens. So I want to introduce you all to Mr. Robert Withers. Mr. Robert, how you doing today, sir?

Robert Withers (02:52)

I’m doing great, Quentin. Thank you so much for having me.

Quentin Edmonds (02:55)

Absolutely, my man. I’m so glad you’re here. And Mr. Robert, I am the type, sir, I like to dive right in. So I would love for you to tell the people what’s your main focus these days. And if you don’t mind, give us a little origin story, kind of how you got into the space that you’re in.

Robert Withers (03:11)

Thanks for asking that question, Quentin. It was— it was quite— actually quite interesting. So I’m from New York. If you haven’t figured that out already, you can probably hear it in my voice. And for any of you who are listening, I’m from the Bronx. You could probably hear the distinction in the— in the borough dialect. So I got involved in the mortgage industry back in— actually, nineteen eighty-six. Nineteen eighty-two, I started working for a company that was the— the start of it all for me. I spent four years there, grew a couple of their sales platforms and was straight out of college. I— I— I— I took a job that was referred to me, believe it or not, by my dry cleaner who noticed the kind of suits that I wore and said, “You should meet my son,” and the rest of it was history. So I— I— I love the industry. I stayed with this— with this company for four years and then went out and started my own company out of my parents’ den. I actually— it was me, a— type— back then, a typewriter, a page-by-page copier, and my parents’ dog sitting at my feet while I would answer the phone and take mortgage applications, run around and take mortgage applications. So that started my— in the— my career in the industry. it led to owning three mortgage companies, selling the first two of them, c— closing one down during the pandemic. I cut my teeth on the residential side of the business, like I said, doing home mortgages for people. It was great. I— it was a w— what an absolute incredible time to grow up in the mortgage industry because things were changing, some of it for the better, because of the fact of the secondary markets opening up, some of it for— for the worse, because as I mentioned, I closed down one of my companies and that was during the mortgage crisis of two thousand and eight, two thousand and nine. Started at that time, I decided to consult for a couple of companies and then came back out of that period of time after that. I took a little time off actually and consulted for some banks and started M1 Capital in 2014, and never looked back. We’ve been in business now since 2014. Myself, I have an assistant, I have a junior analyst, we keep it lean and mean. I look back at the fortunes that I sp— I spent with brick-and-mortar, and I want nothing of it today. So we’re— we’re— we’re a lean and mean mortgage brokerage. And you know, what was it? You and I were having a little bit of a chat prior to this. We’re talking about the word broker. How did you describe yourself to my audience? And I would say I’m a broker. I’m not a consultant, I’m a broker. And broker had a b— negative connotation, especially through the mortgage crisis, because there were a lot of bad brokers out there. You know, they weren’t— they didn’t really know what they’re doing. But a true, really good, in— in— seasoned and experienced broker brings a lot of value to the table because, you know, this is not what you do, Quentin. If you’re out there looking to buy a building and looking to arrange financing, this is not what you do. You know, I speak bank, you don’t, and I’m able to help you work with a bank to make sure that you get the best terms possible. So that’s it.

Quentin Edmonds (07:31)

Love it. Thank you, Mr. Robert, sir. Thank you for taking us through the journey a little bit, telling us where you are, kind of how you got there. now I’m gonna get into like some operational questions, maybe some strategy, but I want to ask this question. I always like to ask each one that comes, person that comes on, business owner that comes on. I often say, Mr. Robert, destiny has no wasted moments, right? Destiny has no wasted moments, meaning like nothing’s random. We’re borrowing from each leg of the journey. We’re borrowing from the lessons. We’re borrowing from the losses. We’re borrowing from the success. So throughout your journey, sir, what has the journey taught you about yourself? What has it revealed to you about you? Has it revealed discipline, humility, changed the way you think when it comes to innovation? Like what has the moment, the journey taught you about yourself?

Robert Withers (08:21)

That’s easy. Never quit. Never quit. Just never quit. You know, I— I know it’s a cliché. You— we’ve heard it. I mean, everybody from Denzel Washington, Oprah is all over social media saying don’t quit, right? But I’ll tell you right now, as a— not a Denzel or an Oprah— Oprah Winfrey, I’ll tell you never quit. Never ever, ever stop.

Quentin Edmonds (08:43)

Wow. Never—

Robert Withers (08:46)

I can’t tell you how many times through my thirty-five years in this industry and in life in total that I was faced with situations that looked insurmountable. Absolutely. And you know what? I got up the next morning, sometimes tougher than others, yeah, sometimes with some help over of other people, sometimes sleeping a little later than I should. Promise you this: I got up and I went out and I did my best to make it happen. Just never quit.

Quentin Edmonds (09:20)

Another question. Is the business owner— at the center of every business is the business owner. And so I asked that question because strategies can change. You may have to pivot, but still you’re at the center. And I want people to be able to reflect and say, “You know, how did I get— how did I get here? What has kept me going?” One of my mentors say, “When you know who you are, you know what to do.” So when I know my why, it powers me to move forward and never quit. And the only time it’s actually over is if I stop and quit. If I don’t stop and quit, then I have a chance to get out of this. And so again, I really appreciate that reflective answer. Absolutely. So, Mr. Robert, what’s one operational thing you’ve put into place the last two years that have made the biggest difference in how you run deals?

Robert Withers (09:56)

Well, ChatGPT. Woo. Woo.

Quentin Edmonds (10:48)

So AI— so AI is not going anywhere, right? So we— we might as well use it, right?

Robert Withers (10:53)

My— my analysis, my ability to analyze and analyze a transaction, my ability to be able to create my next promotional cam— campaign, my ability— my ChatGPT, which I call Jarvis, if you’re an Iron Man fan—

Quentin Edmonds (11:12)

Gotcha. I thought mine’s—

Robert Withers (11:15)

Yeah. You know, they say, you know, what happens if you get attached to something you name or you n— if you name something you get attached to it. Well, guess what? I named chat and I named it Jarvis. And I have brought— I brought Jarvis into the designing and the creation of my consulting company, which I started late last year and launched April first. I— I consult to the real estate finance industry, you know, where I’m dealing on the customer side with my debt brokerage, I’m now dealing on the business side or the lender side with my consulting company. And it built— practically built the business plan for me. So it has— it’s a game-changer. It— it— it— I don’t do anything without sketching it out. Now, Quentin, the old— you know, the old adage, I don’t know if you— I’m older than you, but you know the— the old adage is garbage in, garbage out with computers. The same thing with AI. AI is garbage in, garbage out, yeah, unless you give your AI platform the needed context. If you give it context and the needed context, it can be your greatest asset. otherwise, it— you know, it— it’s not going to develop a business for you, but it’ll help enhance your current business. So I would say AI.

Quentin Edmonds (12:35)

Thank you, sir. Thank you for that answer. I appreciate it and I accept it and I hear you for sure. Mr. Robert, what’s next for you, sir? Like what’s the next real goal? What are you looking to solve at scale next?

Robert Withers (12:49)

Interesting you brought that up because, you know, we had a little conversation about what else I do prior to, you know, me jumping on the— on the podcast, and I’m evolving. Yeah. You know, I like golf, Quentin, but I don’t like it that much. Yeah. So I’m at the p— stage in my life where, you know, you would kick back a little bit, you work a little less, you maybe— but I start— I just started another business. Yeah. I’m consulting to the real estate finance industry on sales performance, what I call sales performance architecture. That’s designing and redesigning their sales platforms, yeah, and that’s what’s next for me. My sales, my mortgage brokerage business, that— that platform is what it’s going to be. I’m not going to scale it. I built companies, I sold them, I had multiple people working for me. I don’t want any part of that. All right. I’ve did it, been there, done that. I had my time. It’s like owning a boat. You own a boat once, you go out on it, you have a great time. You know what the great— two best times of people who own boats? The day they buy it and the day they sell it. The day that I started my company that had multiple pieces going on it, and the day I sold it were the two happiest days of my life. Now I am an independent. I am an entrepreneur who works from home, who helps a set portion of clients that I have grown with and that I— new clients that I invite in. But my— what I’m really excited about is now consulting to the industry that I have given 35 years of my— of my life to. And I’m really excited about it. You know, we launched it, the name of the company is RBW Consulting. The website is robertbrucewithers.com. You can see what we do, how we do it, and why we do it right there.

Quentin Edmonds (15:20)

Love it. Love it. Well, listen, sir, I gotta get your perspective on relationships, business relationships. what relationships have served you well? Who are some of the people who you— you— you partner with who continue to help power your business, who you can sit down and talk to and rely on? So, Mr. Robert, talk to me about your philosophy when it comes to relationship and who are some people within your circle.

Robert Withers (15:45)

So about eight years ago, out of an invitation to start a chapter for another business development group, I started along with another gentleman from White Plains, up up here in White Plains, a breakfast business development group that we c— we have now called the Breakfast Club. And the Breakfast Club is fourteen— fifteen, we’re— we— we get some people in and out, but for the most part we have about an 80% or 80— almost 90 percent retention rate. And they’re business owners or decision-makers of only real estate-centric industries, yeah. So the brokers, the bankers, you know, the— the— the people who service the industry, but you have to be a decision-maker or an owner. And that Breakfast Club group I have now presided over for eight years. We decided early on that we would have a— a— a philanthropic— of a philanthropy aspect to it. There was a philanthropic aspect to it and it drew us all closer. Once we started packing food bags for Feeding Westchester, once we started going to soup kitchens, once we started feeding families at churches on Thanksgiving together, we grew so closer— much closer as a group of people, that I can bring whether or not it’s at a meeting, and certain things are better done in person, but I can go to any of the people that are in that group with a concern, an idea, a strategy or something that’s— that’s on my mind and feel that I’m not only talking to a friend, but I’m talking to a confidant and somebody who really knows me and has my best interests in mind. I had a— I had a mentor in the industry for a long time. mentors change. I’m not old— too old where I wouldn’t consider another mentor, especially given my consulting business. I’m looking at a couple right now, but I’m also a mentor to— to several people in the industry and— and— and similar industries. So I would say that relationships are everything, Quentin. I mean, I know that it’s another cliché, but having relationships— I mean, nobody— no man is an island and— and— and having to bring people into your life and let them get to know you is very important. And how I do that is an extension of my business.

Quentin Edmonds (18:25)

Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Mr. Robert, like listen, I— it’s so many other topics we could talk about. It’s so many things that come to mind that I’m sure we could go into. but I thank you for the wisdom that you’ve given thus far, the experience you’ve given thus far. And if someone— and you gave your website, I’m gonna— I’m gonna put it here cleanly as well. So if someone wanted to reach out to you, connect with you, collaborate with you, learn more about what you’re doing, how can they get in contact with you, Mr. Robert?

Robert Withers (18:54)

Well, if you’re interested in getting in touch with me, it’s probably robert@robertbrucewithers.com. Yeah, the— the mortgage side of it, for— for those who are out there in your audience or looking to finance something, it’s— it’s rwithers@mortgage1.com. But if you’re looking for the consulting side of the business, it’s robert@robertbrucewithers.com. I don’t want to make things too difficult, but the best thing is call me, 914-490-8623. I’m an old-fashioned guy. You know what? Just give me a buzz. I pick up all my calls.

Quentin Edmonds (19:28)

Absolutely. Well listen, I’m glad you gave both because our audience, some of them are— they— they really tune in and they’re dived in it. So I’m glad you gave them the option with both and just gave the number so they can just call and talk. So I appreciate that.

Robert Withers (19:43)

Just whoever’s listening that wants to talk to me, just say, “You know Quentin,” and that’s enough.

Quentin Edmonds (19:47)

Absolutely. Well, listen, sir. Let me say three things to you sincerely. First, thank you for your time. I value people’s time. And so I thank you for coming on and taking time with us. I really appreciate that. secondly, sir, thank you for your story. Thank you for showing up as your authentic self. Thank you for showing up with integrity. I believe our stories plant seeds and we never know when they’re gonna grow, but the seed is there. And so I believe you planted some seeds today. And lastly, sir, thank you for your mindset. Thank you for the way you think and bringing that mindset to this platform. I greatly appreciate you coming on today, sir.

Robert Withers (20:22)

You’re quite welcome, Quentin. Thank you for having me.

Quentin Edmonds (20:24)

Absolutely. Well, listen, y’all heard Mr. Robert. His information is in the show notes. His phone number is in the show notes. Please get in contact with him. Let him help you out. Let him help grow your business. But also make sure you are subscribed here because I promise you, we’re going to continue to bring up amazing people, just like Mr. Robert. So, sir, I say thank you again. And everyone else, listen, y’all have a fantastic day.